I'm thinking about getting me 1d mk3, but this focus issue is not so comforting. Any of you know if canon took care of this issue with auto focus not working properly? Is it worth the investment?
Thanks in advance for your input.

Did they take care of the focusing issue? Yes.

Is it worth the investment? I have mixed feelings. I personally think you're better off getting a used/low count 1Ds Mark II, which will run you about a grand less than a new 1D Mark III.

I guess it just completely depends on your preference, and what you're going to be shooting with it. I personally refuse to upgrade to the 1D Mark II or 1Ds Mark III anytime soon. If I can stick with my 1Ds Mark II and 1D Mark II N for 5 more years, I'll be very happy. I hate the controls on the Mark IIIs

Steven,

I own both the MK II & III, and they are both great cameras. I find I am using my MK III more for the following reasons:

- The auto sensor cleaning is really nice; I see alot more dust w/ my II

- The higher iso capability is really sweet

- The larger screen makes a huge difference.

- The over/ under exposure warning on the screen is really nice

I have not experienced problems w/ the auto focus, and I shoot alot of sports using long lenses. If you are a wedding shooter I think you will find the iso capability worth the upgrade.

Thanks,
Mike

Canon took care of the focus issue with a sub-mirror fix. If you're buying a new camera make sure it has firmware 1.1.3 on it and you'll have the fix already. If not you might be holding an old stock unit that for some reason has not sold yet.

As far as which camera to get.. If you want a 1d I'd say get the Mark III. It has the newest processor, newer sensor, self cleaning, etc..

Plus with a new camera you get a warranty from Canon, anything used it just that.. USED.


Check out www.robgalbraith.com for the article on the mirror fix.

Hmm, seems they actually still haven't fixed it, they are just claiming they did. The issue is an actual mechanical problem not just a firmware upgrade. I'm not sure if the newest camera's have the mechanical upgrade but even if they do, it sounds like that didn't take care of it. Funny that the whole thing has been related to heat building up inside the sub-mirror box and it was not tested in actual hot conditions until the Australian Open...and it failed miserably there!
http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_pag...-8740-9068-9299

There are several reasons to go with a 16.7mp 1dsMKII over the MKIII. The biggest is full frame, followed by working and excellent AF then saving $$$. The downside is the LCD kind of sucks and it's used. I bought one and am loving it.

But maybe the answer is waiting for the new 5D MkII. If the actual camera is anything like the rumors it is going to rock! And if it IS anything like the rumors it seems Canon knows what a failure the MKIII has been and is seeking to release a camera the pro market has been asking for for years.
http://gizmodo.com/367086/canon-5d-mark-ii...ecs-and-details

Excellent info Colin. I read up on the Mark III a lot when I was shopping and I came across this article http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_pag...-8740-9068-9168 which makes it relevant because it compares it to the Mark II. I really considered picking up a used Mark II but I just couldn't pull the trigger on used gear when I can get new, that's supposed to be better. I've only had one focus issue with my Mark III but I think that was my fault. Plus I shoot in one shot mode and never saw any documentation on that mode being a problem. I know Canon has the resources and the ability to fix any problems so I'm pretty happy with my choice.

Even the article I posted praises the Mark II and I do love that body. I've been checking local camera stores to see if any have any old stock of a new one for Laura. I'd love to be able to own both and see the differences 1st hand.

Yeah, it sounds like the only real issue is at full 8fps in AI servo mode. I haven't heard if it is less of an issue at lower fps but I suspect it might be okay. And how often do any of us use a full 8fps? I use a 1dsMKII at 4fps and it is plenty.

Still, it is LAME of Canon to have released a pro camera with all these issues; it kills your resale value. I'm seeing them sell for $3500; $1000 is a lot of loss in just a few months!!! Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating switching systems as Nikon files still look terrible on skin tones (the D3 is a great PJ camera but sucks for portrait work, IMO, who wants splotchy skin?) and I would never switch back to screw type, non-usm prime lenses, that's way too old-school! But given the choice, I went with the tried and true 1DsMKII over the MKIII.

The only problem with the 1dsMKII is the lcd is not very good and the control setup is lame. I've shot about 8k frames with mine so far and still fumble with the controls. I probably wouldn't mix a MKIII and MKII, the control setup difference would make me miss shots when I quickly switched from one to the next.

Yeah, it's a bummer they never released a 1Ds Mark II N. I've only had a Mark II N and when I see the old Mark IIs it kills me how small the screen is!

Thanks for all the info. but you know it doesn't make it any easier.
That new 5d mark 2 sounds idea as well. which bring another issue, full frame vs. aps-c frame and almost 16mp vs. 10 mp.
too many things to consider.
I'm leaning to 1d mark 3 for the reason of being able to shoot in high iso.
Anyways, thank you all for sharing your ideas.

FYI, jpeg's are only about 2mb larger for 16mp vs. 12mp, and at $225 for a 1TB external drive the argument of "too many MP" doesn't hold water.
Full frame is the most important aspect of any camera I buy, that's why I went with the 1ds. The 5dMKII might become my backup though I'm shooting a lot of film these days so I might not really need a backup as I have 2 film camera's...

Hi Steven,

I haven't had any problems with my 1D MKIII yet. It shoots cleanly at high ISOs, and shoots to 2 cards at once, which are the two most important reasons for me purchasing mine.

I'd hate to have to tell a bride and groom that I lost their photos due to a $60 memory card malfunction when they're paying me to shoot their once-in-a-lifetime event.

-Jim

Amen to that - I've been shooting to two cards (Raw to flash and JPG to SD) since owning the 1D MKIIN. I continue with the MKIII. The only thing I don't like about the camera is when selecting the focus point manually (19 points setting) it forces you to go through a maze in the center of the viewer. I'm so accustomed to cruising back and forth / up and down on the MKII's. I just don't get why they did this. Sure there are more points but it could have been set up linearly.

Use the joystick. It's an option with the new firmware.

For all practical wedding and portrait purposes, there is no focus issue. If you don't own any really big glass and shoot high speed sports - it's not ever going to materialize.

I use the joystick as my custom point and really favor using the two dials to access the point. I just don't know why they set it up as a maze and can't believe Canon did this. I guess I'm a bit of an old dog having grown accustom to the 1D MKII and N's that I still use as 2nd camera's.

The AI servo issues are still present with the MKIII. I've shot enough frames with it and the N to see a major difference. My body was not listed on the PDF as one that needs to be updated so perhaps it's just faulty. I basically don't use it in AI Servo for this reason. That doesn't bother me as much as the maze point selection. My assistant picked up my MKIII this weekend and was like "good god what is the deal with this focus point selection". He couldn't believe it. It definitely takes more time to select the point than on the MKII where you can just cruise across, up or down. I just wish there was an option to use both dials and access the point in a linear way.

I love my Mark III.

we had our mark iii repaired, and after the latest firmware update everything works great. I've used it under many situations... sunny and hot, sunny and cool, low light, low contrast, etc... and it has worked very well. the most annoying thing is the screen, which is softer than any other screen out there...

That is the only complaint...a lot of images look a tad soft til you get them on a computer.

Yeah, that bugs me a bit too. But don't get me wrong I love the MKIII. Just wish there was a way to customize the focus point selection. Was at a sunny/hot wedding this weekend and tested out AI Servo on guests being seated (outside ceremony). It didn't compare to the MKIIN even with firmware update. It must be my camera. I'll deal until the end of the season when I have enough time to send it to Canon Pro Services.

No one else out there is bothered by the focus point selection? I'd like to hear from those coming from ID series camera's (not being accustom to using the joystick). It's nice to put one camera down and pick up the other having them dialed in the same. There is so much else that can be customized on this camera - I just want a way to set the point selection up in a linear manner.

coming from the 1d series the joystick just seems so much more intuitive... I was hating the mark iii in favor of my 5d until the latest update

LOL, I'm bothered by lots of Canon's choices in menu and ergonomics... When I switched from the D2h and D2x Nikons to the 1D MkIIn I was like 'WTF is this the stone age?'. That camera was in serious need of an update. I honestly think they got more things right than wrong on the mkIII, but I agree they could easily add that option for selecting focus points.

You're quite right, after picking up the III, the focus point selection makes absolutely no sense whatsover. I have II and I series cameras I can attest to the ease of which the focus points can be selected by selecting the focus point button and then moving either the top or back dial to quickly select the point - without taking your eye from the viewfinder and without having to take your thumb away from the dial. If you work quickly, having the ability to not contort your thumb to the joystick (particularly if you use the portrait grip) is very appealing. Also, if you own and use a MKII alongside your MKIII like Michael here does, then you've got yet another thing to get your head around.

In any case, the point is that for some strange reason Canon thought it would be a great idea to alter the functionality of the focus point selection to a point where it is totally unpredictable. Up/down/left/right makes sense; going around in a maze does not. Sure you can use a joystick but if you like to use the control wheels to select why can't Canon just give us a personal function to do that instead of just totally screwing with the functionality?

I often wonder who on earth they listen to when they gather feedback. If you're a working professional your mind gets mapped to certain functions and if you need to switch between two bodies and have different versions this is a real PITA. In an ideal world we'd all be able to afford to upgrade all of our cameras, but in reality, the old model gets used as a second or third body and not thrown on the scrap pile. Joystick or not, Canon needs to give us a personal function that mimicks the older functionality.

You'd think so.

Welcome to OSP Robert.

its very simple... it goes up... around clockwise, turn, around counter clockwise, turn...

Do you guys really change your focus points that often? I mean I have never had to do this, anytime I want to move to full body but want the face in focus, I half press the shutter button the face, then recompose. I think it would take more time trying to move the focus point...but thats just me.

So I'm not alone??!!! Yippee! I was beginning to think I was too picky Phew!Yeah, I'm moving it all day long. And when I'm wide open I'd like to get it where the action is (ideally eye of the subject) without having to recompose too much which will throw your focus off.

this would all be solved if canon brought EYE CONTROL into their dslrs

Now you're talking!

Wow, thats crazy...guess I will have to give it a try.

Yes - really that often. I've got 45 focus points. I paid for them and I want to use them.

Let's say we're doing a full body shot of a bride walking up the aisle with her new husband. I'm in AI servo mode and I want their faces to be in focus all the time. I frame, select the focus point and then I'm holding the * button to keep focus always on their faces as they are walking towards me. I use a MK2 and right now I just dial it in a quick moment. Sure if I had a MK3 I could use the stick, but I don't want to because if I still had a MK2 I want to use the same controls and that's my point.

I don't just do it for AI Servo, but also for one shot. If I'm taking group shots, I dial the focus point in on the bride's face using one of the top lines of points, focus lock, shoot away, zoom in
, focus lock, shoot away - all without having to re-frame. If I use the center focus point instead I'm liable to screw with my framing and would probably bias the framing of the shot to get the heads within the center of the frame rather than being closer to the top.

This is all personal preference. Everyone works differently and part of the joy of the 1 series is that you can set your personal preferences with a multitude of functions. Canon have effectively changed the controls of a very important component and added a new controller that now does this through a firmware upgrade, but totally neglected to add a personal function to give us the old functionality. All I ask for is for a personal function from Canon to give us choice. That is a BIG thing for me and I probably wouldn't consider a MKIII or IV until I can use my older bodies alongside my new in a consistent manner.

Oh yes! I had it in my EOS 5 and loved it; I used it in an EOS 3 (45 points) and it worked flawlessly for me in landscape and portrait.

I guess eye control won't happen any time soon, so at least Canon could just pull their finger out and just give us a personal function.

Canon should be more like Adobe and Apple and give every user a means of submitting feedback about features instead of speaking with a minority sample group.

I am very happy with my MK3 since the new firmware update. The only thing I wish they would add is a 2nd joystick close to the portrait grip! When I am shooting in portrait orientation and need to switch focus points it is a pain in the a$$ because my thumb does not reach the joystick from that position. That would be sweet if Canon could do a custom mod for this!

Amen! I mean who was the genius who said, "well in the middle we'll have it go around in a loop or v type shape"????

And regarding the dual joystick...this is yet another reason why I stick with the two dial method. It's super easy to spin it up and down...err, um, on the earlier 1D bodies that is...

wow i was being semi-sarcastic about eye-control... it never worked for me =(

Do you blink a lot ??

dude, that is PRECISELY the reason I won't be "upgrading" to the mark III series any time soon. i'm absolutely PISSED about the control layout change, to the point where some people literally laugh at me. but honestly... i'm glad someone else sees my logic here...

oh, and welcome to osp!

It didn't work for many people - sometimes due to calibration, but mainly because people just having different ways of sticking their eye against the viewfinder each time. The functionality died.

So at least with the 1D onwards we were left with the ability to focus quickly using the dials and as daverichards rightly states, the position of the joystick doesn't help if you are using the vertical grip and want to quickly select a focus point.

So essentially we're left with no options.

Maybe the MK4 should have joysticks instead of the focus point buttons on each of the grips I'll keep dreaming.

That makes 2 people that agree with me. Nice! I think we'll need a few more hundred thousand votes to warrant any change

We're laughing WITH you Trevor...

trevor meeks is president of mark II 1ds fan club here on osp... how much are membership dues?

lol i'll send you an invoice. how the heck else am I supposed to support myself?

oh right... it's wedding season. where are all the weddings? I'll save that for another thread haha.

Thanks!

I liken this totally stupid control change to Boeing giving an airline pilot who flies two planes a control stick that does a barrel roll instead of climbing/diving/banking. Makes no sense. Not useful to anyone. Oh, but if the pilot reaches over he can use a brand new control stick, but that only works when you're not turning. Sheer genius.

lol i know... haha believe me, i can relate to both situations!!

it was helpful for newbs like me moving up from the 5D control scheme to the Mark III, the Mark IIs still feel odd to me

exactly, and they changed the controls with NO REGARD for the droves of people who have used the 1D series for YEARS.... fantastic.

My DSLR progression:

Buys D70 - 'cool little camera - maybe digital is for real'
Buys D200 - 'all the things I didn't like about the D70 are fixed!'
Buys D2H - 'amazing battery system and who knew AF could work this good!'
Buys D2X - 'D2H plus a bag of chips - wish the ISO was better...'
Buys 5D - 'camera body sucks, image quality rocks - I'll get used to it'
Sells Nikons and buys 1DmkIIn - I took 40k images with the MkIIn (over about a year) and not a day went by I didn't think about throwing it under a bus - low light focus sucked - battery system sucked - way to heavy - menu system and controls from the stone ages. Great for field sports.

Sells MkIIn and buys used MkIII - 'aaahhhhhh - best $1k I ever spent - still not as nice as a D2h/D2x (!!) but it's got that good Canon sensor - I'm happy'

My 5D still focuses in low light as well as any camera I've used, just not as fast as the big bodies (from either company), but it doesn't hunt as long as you're using the center focus point and a fast prime...

This is the best analogy yet that describes my pain. Would love to hear from more folks who were raised on the 1D bodies.

thing is, i wasn't even raised on the 1D bodies. i started with a 20D and bought my Mark II N shortly afterward. you know what? i actually see the logic in the original 1D control layout and took to it very quickly. I CANNOT STAND the 20D/30D/40D/5D control layouts... they frustrate me to no end and the way functions are set is a lot more time consuming than with the 1D. Also, the 1D is laid out so as not to allow accidental settings changes... too bad the same can't be said for the other cameras.

i really wish there was something to be done. too bad canon probably won't revert back to the "stone age" controls... which is sad because they really are the only company I'll buy a camera from.

Damn right!

But they could/should make as many menu options to ease the transition as possible.

Yes and I doubt they'll revert too, but that's why there are the Personal Functions. They should indeed make the transition easy - we're not stupid, we just like to work quickly and easily. Just one additional firmware upgrade to allow for the older, more intuitive focus point selection is required.

the settings:
0 = new and crappy (go round in a circle in the centre, then to the edges)
1 = use top and back wheel to go left/right/up/down.

Surely we're not asking too much here?

I think I just figured out the reason why they moved to the 'new and crappy' way: photographers at airshows were complaining that they couldn't choose the focus point quick enough when the new planes fitted with the genius control sticks were doing barrel roles - that's why it goes around in a circle

Muppets

It's all personal preference. The Mk. II controls are atrocious, IMO. They're illogical, and unless you were blessed with a third hand, they're harder to switch up on the fly. The Mk. II controls are the reason why Canon's ergo's have been criticized for so long.

My .02. It's fine if people don't like the Mk. III layout ... no one is forcing them to buy it