David (or anyone that is currently shooting with this camera),
I am actually considering Canon as a possibility as we are getting ready to start moving over to digital. Best I can tell, you have had a great experience with your MkII's, but I would like you to be real blunt and honest and bring up any negative points about the camera (too heavy, startup is too slow, controls are hard to get used to, etc.)
Thanks!

Nathan

Hey Nathan! That's awesome...and depending on how much I like the 20d I may sell one of my Mark II's so keep that in mind. As for +'s and -'s here's my take:

GOODS

1. ISO adjustment...it's been VERY nice being able to adjust the iso in 3rd stop increments and I think this will be a big difference between the 20d and the Mark II. I'm sure MusciManChris will agree with me here. (update) Also, being able to see what ISO you're using without pressing any buttons is something I really like about the Mark II and it frustrates me when I'm shooting with the 20d.

2. Startup is immediate (or close to it at least) I remember the 10d was kinda slow and that might be another difference between the 20d and Mark II - we should find out this week! (update) both startup great!

3. BUFFER! The buffer is phenominal! I'm not sure yet but I think this could be another sore spot for 20d'ers. Especially those shooting in Raw... The Mark II pulls 20 Raw shots before it has any trouble, and with an 80x card it'll recover in around a minute - but of course you'll be able to continue shooting during that time. (update) - this is the biggest difference in my opinion! 20d lags compared to the Mark II and if shooting RAW you'll definitely find yourself waiting on the camera.

4. Customization - The Mark II is truly YOUR camera...by that I mean you can do anything you want with it and I still haven't had time to figure out all the ways I can make it more efficient for me to use. There are so many custom functions and personal functions it's rediculous - but very cool!

5. It's a pro camera! So it looks, feels, acts, and has been tested like a pro camera. It's a solid piece of gear that isn't gonna break on you (I'd still have a backup though )

6. Firewire

7. Navigation is sweet - took a little getting used to after the 10d but now it's much quicker. I think the 20d may have it beat though! With the new little joystick thing the 20d should be easier to navigate as well as adjust the focusing points. Dana's a big fan of this!

8. Noise levels - WOW! Even noise that I see in the images don't come through in the prints. It's truly amazing. I shoot at 500 - 1000 iso all the time without any reservation. I think the 20d has the same type sensor so that rocks...although I've heard that b/c the 20d's sensor is smaller the noise could increase...again, we'll find out soon! (update) Both noise levels are super low - shoot away

9. On that note, 1.3x allows you to keep your same lenses and be fine. With the 20d and their new EF-S lenses people will be stoked...but ya gotta buy new lenses that I think only work on that camera... ...and I don't think these S lenses are L series glass???

10. Battery power - I think it's partially solar powered because I never change batteries - GOOD THING I BOUGHT 4!!!


BADS

1. Getting shots sharp was tougher, but the more I use the camera the less of an issue it is...I don't even think about it anymore and the shots look great! I think the initial problem had to do with it being a bigger, heavier camera with a larger sensor (meaning less depth of field).

2. Expensive - kinda. I guess it's not as expensive as some of the other pro cameras, but chances are they'll come out with something new and cheaper. Technology is crazy like that!

3. I think I'm really gonna like the joystick thing on the 20d for changing focusing points (which I've been doing a little more of) so I wish the Mark II had a little easier way to go up and down with the focusing points...actually it might and I just don't know about it. (update) I realized that you don't have to keep the focusing point button pressed while changing the points and that made all the difference in the world!

4. Little lockups every now and again...never created a problem though (and this could be a card issue) ...I imagine the more like computers our cameras get the more we'll be dealing with this. Pretty soon we're gonna be CTRL-ALT-DELETE'ing in the shower and while driving, and cooking, and...you get the point! It's gonna take over our lives!!!

Again, I'm gonna add to this list so pop back in!

Happy Monday!
DJ

Hey David, are you saying that the lenses we use for the 10d and mark II won't work on the 20D?

FYI....

startup time on the 20D is gonna be something like .2 seconds or something. So it's very fast.

ISO control on Mrk II.......SOOOOO sweet.

~chris

sorry to confuse you.... don't worry they'll work...the new ef-s lenses that are made for the 20d won't work on our 10d's or Mark II's, but all the old lenses are golden on all the cameras.

I'm really enjoying my 20D, but I have a hunch those who have the Mark II won't be selling them anytime soon. The 20D is a great camera for the money, but it definitely "feels" prosumer compared to the Mark II. Before I got my 1D, I didn't really understand the distinction between a Pro camera and the other really fantastic bodies. I wondered why Canon didn't just call the D30, D60 or 10D Pro cameras. But once I started really using the Mark II, I understood. It's the difference between an amazing college basketball team and the NBA. Even with the 20D's bells and whistles, and with the sometimes awkward two button adjustments needed with the 1D, I don't think there's any comparison. Follow Agency VII and get the Mark II.

Hey guys,

I actually went shopping today for my 20D at this store in Texas. I have been paying close attention to all the specs that ya'll have mentioned. I even had to try all the lenses that DJ uses with this M2...are ya'll like really buff????? Tried the 20-70, and the 200mm one...It was soooo heavy!!!!!! How do you guys do it?

So now I'm torn....I want what everyone else is shooting with. I could really purchase a couple of 20D's and three really good lenses and just get rid of my 300D. Or just get a mark 2 and use my rebel for back up. (but that'd be like driving a Benz and then on a rainy day having to drive a moped)

I also tried that Rebel XT...talk about small!!!!!! Hardly weighs anything! And the body feels soooo cheap and plastic.

I could really use some advice. Should I just take Dane's advice from above and get the M2? Is anyone here on the forum considering buying the newest one????? the 16.7 MP one?? It's only a few more than the Mark 2...

Help

I'm just soooo ready to go mainstream with everything...

if money is the issue go with the 20D. it's a great camera. Keep your rebel for backup.

if you don't have the L series lenses yet, get those. Those are a must. Personally, I'd rather have great lenses and a cheaper camera then the other way around.

The 20D is just a bit too much like the Mrk II to be worth the extra cash, unless you have the extra cash and already have the lenses.

That's my 2 cents.

Also, I'm just waiting for the Mrk III or something like that to come out. At this point I wouldn't get the Mrk II, just cause it's getting a bit old and pretty soon Canon will come out with something else to beat it out that will be even better and then you'll wish you had that!

In the meantime, I'm more than happy with my 20D.

how do you know about the M3? anything you care to share with me about it? Anything I can read about it?????

By the way...is anyone seriously thinking about the 1Ds M2????? Just curious is all. If I'm going to spend my hard earned money...I want the best.

I mean...don't get me wrong...I would be satisfied with the 20D...that's what I was primarily looking at....but now I'm able to spend a little more freely...

What would you guys do?

I would do as Chris stated... Get the 20D and high quality lenses...

--- Gregg

Katherine,

The 1Ds is definitely an amazing camera, but it's important to choose the right camera for the work you are doing. With that HUGE sensor and some of the other specs, the 1Ds is more of a studio and product camera. The 1D is designed for weddings, sports and photojounralists.

So as some of the others guys have said, go for either the 1D or 20D.

Kurt

Thanks for all your advice!!! Gosh...I've never been sooo amped!!