[davidjay]

Hey Everyone,

I'm sad to do this but I have asked Tami to find another place to hangout. I hate doing things like this but I've asked her enough times to be nice to the people here and I continue to get bombarded with emails from people directing me to places where she stirs up negativity.

Remember - this is a place to help people so if you're here and someone asks you for help then help them! If you don't want to help people then don't hangout here.

All the best,
dj

[Aaron Pelly]

David, have you talked to LB? Did you see her post?

[ChrisS]

Since we're being honest, if you told me this 6 months ago, I would have been happy but I'm not. Tami comes off a little strong to the newbies but once you get to know her, she really is a nice person and is very helpful to a lot of people on here. Her work is very professional and her style is very unique in a world where we're all trying to copy one another.

When she does get a little abrasive to people, she usually has a good foundation for her opinions but she doesn't hold anything back and some people just don't know how to handle that kind of honesty...for a while I couldn't handle it but once you learn more about her, it becomes easier.

Anyway, what's done is done but I just wanted to say something on her behalf because I think she's not entirely understood by newer people.

[Kristin Carlson]

I personally understand what Chris means but I agree with David for asking for her leave. Though I'm sure Tami is often just trying to help people, I don't think it's necessary to be so mean about it. People say that it's just honesty but in my opinion, that's like someone ripping someone off and saying 'it's just business'. Unethical is unethical and mean is mean. People use a lot of excuses to be mean. They say they're helping people learn, they say that they're being honest but honest doesn't have to be mean. I'm not saying that criticism is bad but when it's more about being spiteful and rude and less about being constructive and helpful, it simply doesn't contribute to a happy community and I think that that applies in real life communities and online communities.

[davidjay]

Many studies have shown that people learn 5x faster through encouragement than they do through "constructive" criticism so if our desire is truly to help people then encouragement is the way to do it. We should work hard to find the one thing we like about what somebody is doing and encourage them to keep doing more of that instead of pointing out the things they aren't doing well.

I imagine we all feel the pressure to get sucked into the negativity and so let's fight against that.

Happy Saturday!
dj

[killashandra]

Wow. I totally disagree with this decision, but it is yours to make.

[Emma Smith]

I am very disappointed also.

[davidjay]

I'm disappointed as well.

[colleen]

I agree with David. Tami loved to stir the pot and she was often times downright mean about it. I saw no reason for her to post what she did about the message she recieved from LB. I mean really! Someone sends you a private message and because you are on your high horse (like Tami ALWAYS is) you post about it in the forum all the while degrading the person who sent it?? Really?

If we can't ask eachother questions and expect a polite response then I don't suppose any of us should be here. I think it was waaaaaay over the top for Tami to post what she did. How rude - and I don't think it matters at all that she didn't say who it was from - she wanted everyone to get their pom poms and say 'Go Tami! You're so right! Down with those idiot photographers who dare to ask for advice.' Give me a freakin' break.

[JennLink]

*thumbs up*

[crcossel]

I'm going to have to agree too. I've been on the receiving end myself and I always wondered why she was so harsh. I don't think "that's the way someone is" is an excuse for being mean. Especially in the internet world where we all need to be a bit more sensitive to how we come across as we don't have personal interaction to temper what we are saying.

[camalo]

The point of a private message is that is should remain private. There was no reason Tami couldn't message the poster back her thoughts - instead she had to publicize them and get everyone on her side.

I think most of us agree that a photographer shouldn't take a wedding with traditions he or she isn't familiar with, but I also think very few of us would have posted a private message. She knew LB was going to see it. What was the point? Humiliation?

I'm rather new here myself and I know I've asked stupid questions, but I've never been on the receiving end of harsh treatment. Fortunately it seems the majority of posters here are positive and encouraging, even in giving criticism.

[Jeremy Chou]

good call DJ

[Mark T.]

I do not agree with "asking" Tami to move on; not that my agreement matters to David. This is his baby and he can treat it and the people here however he wants. But Tami was the most original artist on this board full of too many all doing the same thing. She went her own way and said what was on her mind. She was honest, if brutally so at times.

There have been some removed from the board for good reasons, spammers and the like, but others who have been removed because they didn't conform to the ideal that David has in mind for his marketing playground.

Tami spoke the truth as she saw it. Nothing wrong with that. She certainly wasn't calling people morons, assholes, and idiots like others do.

I guess it's all sunshine and rainbows at OSP, which apparently isn't "Open" Source Photo for everyone.

Get a moderator team David.

ETA - Tami was also probably the most prolific poster on a board that is seeing participation dwindle to a very level lately. You can talk about all the hundreds joining, but the facts are that looking at the members added list, there are very few coming to OSP.

ETA again - to illustrate my point...

Pro4Um ($249/yr) - 103.7K threads, 1.7M posts, 16.3K members
OSp (free) - .5M posts, 12.6K members

OSp is free, and has 75% of the member base that Pro4Um has, but only less than 30% as many posts. Why is that?

This post has been edited by Mark T.: 12 June 2010 - 01:57 PM

[MarthaH]

Mark T., on 12 June 2010 - 05:34 PM, said:

ETA - Tami was also probably the most prolific poster on a board that is seeing participation dwindle to a very level lately. You can talk about all the hundreds joining, but the facts are that looking at the members added list, there are very few coming to OSP.

ETA again - to illustrate my point...

Pro4Um ($249/yr) - 103.7K threads, 1.7M posts, 16.3K members
OSp (free) - .5M posts, 12.6K members

OSp is free, and has 75% of the member base that Pro4Um has, but only less than 30% as many posts. Why is that?

+1
Thank you for pointing this out. There is no doubt in my mind that participation will dwindle even more without Tami, who started SO many new threads.

[LyssaH]

I can't say if I think Tami should have been kicked off or not because I haven't been a part of the forum for very long. She was definitely an artist and EXTREMELY good at what she does. But, maybe just a bit of a reprimand was necessary for her last post about the wedding thing. She know LB was going to see it. That post was meant for straight humiliation and ego boosting. I think that she has amazing knowledge and was a great asset to this forum. Just sad to see it end like this.

[crcossel]

Ok, so I ask this with complete sincerity.

For those that defend tami, do you honestly think this last thread was correct? Especially once the private message was made public it was obvious it was not the panic she made it out to be.. Even if she really thought at was I can't believe someone would think it's right to then post about it publicly obviously embarrassing the person. It is intentional rudeness isn't it? Why is basic human politeness not a standard to be held to?

[Mark T.]

She pointed out no names, or other details to identify the person that PM'd her. Her thread wasn't in response to that PM, but to the rash of those types of posts. That PM was just what finally pushed her to say something.
Polite? Not really. But I've known others that were brash and abrupt and offended people, while dispensing advice that was sound, critiques that were spot on.

Any old PWP's here remember Dan? Tami reminds me a little of him in her manner.

I'm just disappointed that it seems the "Open" is not so open.

[Emma Smith]

I agree with Mark. She didnt name names or post anything until LB came to post admitting it was her, etc...

Quote

It isintentional rudeness isn't it? Why is basic human politeness not a standard to be held to?

also might I point out, adressing as her "wicked witch" right thats polite, kind and not intentionally rude at all is it???


I honestly dont think Tami posted that thread to boost her ego.. wow... its funny how the internet can twist things.. she was frustrated by those types of posts.. and while it was a PM that might have started it, there have been MANY posts like that in the past...

But you know at the end of the day this is just a forum... and make of it what you will.

[~stephaniefoto~]

I quit posting because of people like her. Really not kidding.

I was very active at first but felt like crap so often when I logged off. I specifically remember on multiple occasions crying because of what Tami had said to me. I have come along way in a year and now feel confident to poke my nose out again here. It will make others that ARE here to learn and share more comfortable if people are not being treated the way Tami treated people. She was really nice to the ones she respected but thrived off treating the "not so amazing" photographers like crap. I am relived she is gone. I liked looking at her work but as soon as she opened her mouth I had to roll my eyes because Tami is never wrong. In her mind anyway.

Like David said. We are here to learn and grow by encouragement not bully the beginners because they are not good enough. Look at Davids testimony and you can see where his heart is at. I love the foundation on which this place was built. We need to think about that.